TOPIC:

The thing that I don't understand is that to get the KSA alone you had to have 18 months continuous service......

When did the Middlesex arrive in South Africa, that is if he was Middlesex.....

If he was Imp. Yeo. he would have the two bars or a KSA with both bars.....

Mike

I am a lttle surprised that you think there is a single clasp on the KSA, clearly there are two and at least six on the QSA, the photograph, in terms of quality, is one of the worst that I have ever seen.

Genes Project wrote: The gentleman below was a mate of Sergeant Edward George Ryde (or Ted/Bert), and his photo was found amongst his papers/photos on his body when he was killed going 'over the top' at Neuve Chapelle 10 Mar 1915. He is merely referred to as 'Tim' which is probably a nickname. This photo was taken at the wedding of Bert's Best Man, Henry Anderson, in autumn 1913. They were both sergeants in the 2nd Middlesex, and I think 'Tim' was too.

I was interested to see only a single bar on his KSA and three bars on his QSA. The other medal is a Long Service Good Conduct medal. Apparently there were only 11 single bar KSAs in the Middlesex.

I have a list of the NCOs in the 2nd Middlesex from the 1911 census so I'm plodding through 'testing' each name at Ancestry and MilitaryArchive to see if I get a good match.

So has anybody got any insight on this? Am I possibly barking up a wrong tree?

Cheers, Colin

Ummm, yes you did indeed need that time for a KSA and that was why it was so difficult (impossible?) to get one without a QSA.

So that means either 1) the KSA 'shown' in the photo is something else or 2) there are eight clasps photographically fused into four as Frank says.

The photograph "in terms of quality, is one of the worst" is because he is a tiny figure in a large group photographic print that is a hundred years old. We can only use what survives!

After much much thought I am indeed veering towards option 2. If that is the case, it narrows down to six soldiers if 'Tim' is a soldier in the same unit as the aforesaid NCOs:

No. 656 Quartermaster and Hon. Lieut. Frank Allam, age 47 (CC/OFS/T/TH/RL/LN/1901/1902)
No. 5371 Sergeant Master Tailor Robert Hewitt, age 35 (T/N/1901/1902)
No. 3804 Colour Sergeant Thomas Woolmore, age 37 (CC/OFS/T/TH/RL/LN/1901/1902)
No. 5781 Sergeant Harry Trezona, age 32 (CC/OFS/T/TH/RL/LN/1901/1902)
No. 5211 Private George Ashford, age 43 (CC/TH/RL/1901/1902)
No. 3008 Private Walter Augustus Ellis, age 38 (CC/OFS/T/TH/RL/LN/1901/1902)

(Numbers as given in their QSA/KSA/LSGC rolls, ranks and ages as in 1911, bars on QSA)
So, a mix of 4, 5 and 8 bars on the QSAs - none corresponding to the 6 on the photo.

Ho hum...

LOL Mike,
As "Tim" is unknown it can only be speculation to assume he was a member of the 2nd Middlesex during the campaign, though, of course, had he been, then he would certainly be entitled to his pair for the ABW, they arrived in 1899 and were part of Coke's division.
Regards Frank

QSAMIKE wrote: The thing that I don't understand is that to get the KSA alone you had to have 18 months continuous service......

When did the Middlesex arrive in South Africa, that is if he was Middlesex.....

If he was Imp. Yeo. he would have the two bars or a KSA with both bars.....

Mike

Frank Kelley wrote: LOL Mike,
As "Tim" is unknown it can only be speculation to assume he was a member of the 2nd Middlesex during the campaign, though, of course, had he been, then he would certainly be entitled to his pair for the ABW, they arrived in 1899 and were part of Coke's division.
Regards Frank

Yes it is indeed speculation now.

The 'shortlist' was based on solid logic though. 'Tim' appeared in Henry Anderson's wedding photo, Tim was in the Middlesex. Henry was Bert's Best Man. Henry and Bert were both C platoon, 2nd Middlesex. A photo of 'Tim' was found on Bert's body in 1915.

I was hoping a good match with medals could identify a unique individual that was in 2nd Middlesex in 1911 and who was in S. Africa in any military unit long enough to get a QSA/KSA and also had a LSGC.

But no match, so it will now always remain speculation.

Cheers,

Colin

hi, I would agree that the clasps are to thick for a Q.S.A, only a thought mind you, but how a bought an Egypt 1885-9 judging on the straight suspender, the next medal possibly central Africa 1898 ? an unusual combination but possible.